CIA The World Factbook

YI: Yet Malaysia is such a pluralistic society, how does all this debate affect people who are not Muslims?

Marina Mahathir: It's affecting them greatly. It makes them wonder what is their place in Malaysia. They are citizens, our constitution guarantees equal rights to every citizen in this country, and yet there are people trying to separate that, saying you have left and right because of your religion and Muslims have more. That's not the way the country was founded on. So I think these people have the absolute right to question. There are people who say they should not question at all anything to do with Islam, because it makes Muslims uneasy, which to me is a strange logic. If I have faith in my own religion I should never be uneasy and I should welcome questions because then I can answer, rather than leave people wondering whether Islam is really such an unjust, unkind religion. I think it's un-Islamic anyway to be anti-pluralism because it says in the Qu'ran that God made us of different people so that we get to learn to know each other. So, to me, that means he intended us to be diverse.

YI: So do you think that is being a destructive element?

Marina Mahathir: It is. Of course, it is, because Malaysia was founded on being multi-racial, multi-ethnic, multi-religious and everything. So, it's attacking the very principles that Malaysia is based on. Anyway, not only do we not living in a monolithic, mono-racial country but we also don't live in a mono-racial world. What do you do if you go out there? It's a pluralistic world anyway. We have to deal with that. So, to say that pluralism is wrong, to me, defies all logic. How do you survive unless you want to go and live under your little coconut shell, and that's it?

YI: How can this problem be solved? How can it lead to this conducive environment?

Marina Mahathir: Well, I think there should be bolder voices to counter this kind of thinking. Never mind who it comes from. Say it comes from a high-up ulama, I think people should come out and say that it's wrong. And today I see in the papers there are ministers and such people who are saying this is are wrong. But there should be more. People should explain why it's wrong and that this is not a country just for Muslims or just for Malays. Not at all. I'm Malaysian, in some ways you could almost say we're irreligious by saying that we should be pluralistic. I'm Malaysian, certainly.

YI: Actually, your critics say you still need to learn to distinguish "Muslims" from "Islam." What do you say to that?

Marina Mahathir: I don't know what that means. You mean I'm Muslim, so I adhere to Islam, right? What is the difference? I don't know. I'm a Muslim. I follow Islam. I don't know what that means.

YI: Do you consider yourself to be a good Muslim?

Marina Mahathir: I consider myself to be a Muslim which I will try hard to be as good as possible. It might not be in the same way that other people interpret it, but I try and do my best. In the end, I will answer to God.

YI: Let's get away from serious issues and get to a question which everyone wants to know: do you think your father misses the limelight? Why is he attacking the Prime Minister?

Marina Mahathir: I don't think it's a matter of limelight. He's had the limelight on him for much more than 22 years, 30 years over. Limelight is not always good, anyway. I think he feels very passionately that his life's work is not going the way that he wanted it. I think he feels this country deserves a good run. He's done his best and he feels that some of the things being done might actually harm it. So he feels he has the right to voice it out. And why not? I don't think it's at all for himself. He's a leader, not crave going back there. He loves being in retirement. Not least because it makes him free to say what he wants. But that's it. I think if we don't understand the passion of our politicians, or someone who's been in there, real if you like, you'll find it hard to understand. Perhaps, now people go into politics for different reasons, so they say, "what's the big deal?" For him it's a big deal. It's his country, it's his people.

YI: Does he listen to the views of the young? To you?

Marina Mahathir: Maybe other young people. Not us. Certainly not me. He thinks I'm far too radical for anything, for any good advice. So, not much, no.

YI: In the midst of your many activities, what do you do to relax and recharge your batteries?

Marina Mahathir: Not much, really. I have my husband and kids, I guess. Not that that's always relaxing. But I cant say have that much time to relax, as such. I like what I do, I like the fact that I'm busy. I like having to think of about so many things. So, I guess that's not much of a line between work and relaxation for me. So, it's fine.

YI: Do you read books?

Marina Mahathir: I wish I read more because I just don't have the time to read for pleasure. I'm reading things all the time. I'm reading emails, I'm reading newspapers or articles and things like that, but just to read for pleasure has become a real luxury. So, I look forward to holidays when I can do that. But when you have kids with you, always wanting to do something, it's difficult.

YI: Did you ever think about writing a biography of your father?

Marina Mahathir: My father is writing his own memoirs and I'm trying to help him with it. Not writing it but helping to organize it to be published. And I think that's the priority at the moment, so until he does that, I don't think I'll do my own writing yet.

YI: Marina, with all these programs that you are advocating, what do you hope to achieve?

Marina Mahathir: Some change, I hope. All these causes, about women particularly, they affect me. I have daughters to think about. It's their future that I'm concerned about. I want them to live in this country, I want them to have the opportunities that anyone should have and I worry that these types of conservative development will impede their opportunities in the future. So I'm doing it for them, and I'm doing it for all young women in Malaysia, because I think it's important.

YI: Are you optimistic at how things will turn out?

Marina Mahathir: At the moment I'm not sure, but what gives me some hope is that I see a lot of young people who are getting braver at speaking out, writing about these things, and just going on and doing their own thing. I think that they are the ones who will really pave the shape of Malaysia in the future. Unless something really happens to really put them down, I think there's some hope. I think they are the real leaders of the future.

YI: On that note, Marina, I'd like to say once again, thank you for being with us today.